We want to honour our dear friend Mat Steinwede today. Mat recently experienced the unbearable loss of his son and his story is a powerful reminder of the resilience and strength that's often needed in life and in business.
Inspired by Mat's tenacity, we discuss strategies for coping with 'Black Swans' and discuss the role of a supportive team in times of tragedy, and the lessons we can learn from the book 'Option B' - finding strength in adversity.
We will also focus on the importance of being fully present in our work, right up until our break starts. We owe that to the people we service. Remember, Christmas starts on 25 Dec, not mid-Nov.
Let's dive in, as we hold space for grief, resilience, and the unwavering spirit of the human condition.
We want to honour our dear friend Mat Steinwede today. Mat recently experienced the unbearable loss of his son and his story is a powerful reminder of the resilience and strength that's often needed in life and in business.
Inspired by Mat's tenacity, we discuss strategies for coping with 'Black Swans' and discuss the role of a supportive team in times of tragedy, and the lessons we can learn from the book 'Option B' - finding strength in adversity.
We will also focus on the importance of being fully present in our work, right up until our break starts. We owe that to the people we service. Remember, Christmas starts on 25 Dec, not mid-Nov.
Let's dive in, as we hold space for grief, resilience, and the unwavering spirit of the human condition.
Tom Panos, john McGraw, troy, malcolm, million-dollar agent. The podcast coming to you heading to the summer season. Hey, john, hi Troy, how are you going?
John McGrath:Morning Tommy. Very well Troy G'day.
Troy Malcolm:Hello, hello, john and Tom, very good, very good, happy. It's coming to that time of the year when everyone's energy levels go even higher than what they were during spring, so I think it's good, some good results out there and an interesting time in the market, tom.
Tom Panos:Yeah, so, troy. Firstly, every person I speak to today, I keep reminding them that Christmas is on the 25th of December, not the 25th of November, because there is a few people that said to me in the last two days oh geez, it's come around so quick, I go. What's that Christmas? I said, listen, you still can list and sell houses. I said you had a few days off with Melbourne Cup and all sorts of stuff. I said we've still got four or five weeks and there's a tremendous amount of business that gets done in the four weeks leading up to, let's say, the mid-Mid of December. There is just so many people that do deals in this period. It would be crazy not to. And in fact I still think, troy and John, you've been talking auctions this morning when I spoke to you about your auction department. I think your auction department is going to be booking auctions right until the 16th of December. Troy, would that be right?
Troy Malcolm:Yeah, Tom, I've got bookings on the 16th and I've also got one booking on the 19th of December as well, so in midweek that's my last one for the year.
Tom Panos:Yeah, and John, from your own experience these years, I mean and you get franchise returns and company figures, so you've got good access to it. Don't think for a moment, and I'm sure you'd agree, john. Deals are still being done well into December.
John McGrath:Oh, absolutely, Tommy, They'll be done on Christmas Eve. They'll be done, some done on New Year's Eve. Some people might even work through the break. In fact, some markets come to life during the Christmas break. So I think everyone deserves a break and for most people in real estate, Christmas New Year is the logical time when there's least activity.
John McGrath:But I know Dr Fred used to say to us that make sure you work up until the last minute on the last day you've decided to take off and make sure you start working from the first minute of the first day you're back. Because a lot of people they say oh look, I'm off from the 15th, but really from the first to the 15th of December. They're kind of on a quasi holiday anyway. They're taking long lunches, they're not really prospecting, and then they say they're back on the 10th, but they come back on the 10th and they really just fluff around for a week or two. So I think it's good advice to work hard and smart until the moment you leave and then hard and smart until the moment you're back. I think that really makes a lot of sense because there is a ton of business to be done right up until the moment you leave, whatever time that is.
Tom Panos:Yeah, well, said Well. By the way, I exchange contracts on my current home, which I've been there for 15 years, or 12, 13 years of Michael Tringale in Haberfield, at 5 o'clock on the 24th of December, and I still remember Michael saying to me Tom, let's get it done now, because if we don't, this vendor has the whole Christmas holiday to change their mind about the price, change their mind about you, change their mind about selling, let's bring closure. And that happened on the 66W certificate, which in New South Wales is an unconditional sale was done at around 5.15 on the 24th of December about a decade ago.
John McGrath:No too true, too true get the deals done. Time heals deals.
Tom Panos:Okay, this podcast. I'm actually dedicating it and we all are, because you work with him, john, you're close to him, troy's close to him, I'm close to him. Our great friend Matt Steinway, and I've said it before, I've said it before today I believe that Matt Steinway, in the last 35 years, is the best real estate agent in Australia. If we're using the 35 year period right, because a lot of the guys that we see now they haven't been in it for that long. This guy's absolutely class. By the time people are listening to this podcast, they would have been aware, because he does. You know he's very active on social media and he's been courageous to explain a personal matter the death of his son, the famous Sir Philogen, passed away about a week ago.
Tom Panos:And, john, I mean, we're not going to spend talking analyzing all of that, but we know that Matt Steinway is one of many, many people who in their life get a punch in the face out of the blue. Unexpected things fall apart, derails everything. Sometimes it's the loss of a family member, sometimes it's the loss of a relationship, sometimes it's a terrible diagnosis and an illness and coming to grips with what that means. Sometimes it's just anxiety, depression, sometimes it's a financial issue. But, troy and John, before we talk about some of the coping strategies we've learned, great people have when they do get that punch in the face, when things fall apart, all of a sudden, our thoughts are with Matt, I've got to tell you.
Tom Panos:I mean, as terrible as it is, matt Steinway is the most prepared person to actually turn this from being a victim to become a victor. He's a sort of guy he actually keeps. You know, I liaise with him by text message every day and he's said to me, john, exactly what he said to you, and that is that he is looking at ways and I'm bringing up exactly the long message he sent me looking at ways, how he can turn this pain into purpose and into a legacy. And I think, john and Troy, there's no better person that I know on the planet that's capable of doing it. He's been training this, he's been training for this for 35 years the ability to move forward when things are looking really grim. So I'll be with you guys.
John McGrath:Yeah, well, look for those that hadn't caught up, I think everyone knows Matt or knows of. Matt is an incredibly successful, hyper profile and beautiful human being and one of his sons, he's got six or seven kids, he's got a large family and one of his sons took his life about a week ago. And so it's as you just said, tommy, beautifully, that it's a tragic circumstance and no one can skate through a situation like this without it being incredibly painful. Yeah, maybe the most painful thing one can ever be asked to endure. But yeah, look, it's, and we send our love to Mattie and his family, a step family, his brother's sisters. He's very Logan was very, very well loved and if you haven't seen, if you go on to have a look at Matt's TikTok and you'll see a beautiful I mean heart wrenching but nonetheless beautiful, short, I guess celebration or just a little presentation Matt did about Logan. So, yeah, let's just hug our loved ones and kids and spouses and friends a little bit tighter, because you never know when they're not going to be here. But and that was a total shock to all involved, with Logan and with Matt, which is the total tragedy and a shock, and it's interesting when we talk through about topics like this, because I think, tommy, you were wanting to not only dedicate this podcast but talk through what are some of the I don't know whether you're called strategies, but things one can do.
John McGrath:Be yourself if you're caught in this situation, or for loved ones, because often it's. It may not be you, but it could be someone very, very close to your family member or loved one. And I think it was Gary Vaynerchuk I heard recently on TikTok and he said you know you're either in the middle of a tragic scenario or challenging time or one's about to hit. So you know, when you think about how many people you know and how many health issues there are and divorces and things, it doesn't have to be, you know, someone losing their life it can be, can be other health issues, it can be relationship, it can be financial, it can be a whole range of things. So I think it's a good topic to talk about, to go through it, and you know, here's one of the things I've learned, tommy and Troy I think that you know when these things happen and often I'm the same I stare at my phone and I want to reach out and I want to call, but I don't know what to say and I don't.
John McGrath:Then I start thinking they'll be inundated with calls and they probably will have their phone off and you kind of say all these things. Here's my best advice just call and just reach out and just listen more than anything. And I think that's the because there are no words you can say to bring Logan back, there are no words one can say to make the pain of losing Logan any less painful than than it is for Matt. But just reach out and let him know and yeah, people know, some people you know sort of a phone call other people to be a text, but but I think it's it's important just to let them know that you're here for them, let them know that you care, let them know that if they need anything at all, that you're there because you know. Otherwise we can talk ourselves out of it and not make contact because we don't want to interfere. But then all of a sudden we feel guilty within God. You know I didn't really do anything practical.
John McGrath:So my advice when that happens, the first thing, troy, is just to just to reach out and to listen more than talk and don't use any cliches, you know, just just say, hey, I remember after I rang Matt straight after I found out it was on the Monday, tommy, and you know I was told in sort of strictest confidence and you know, I think you were the only person I actually told because I know how close you are to Matt and I just rang him up and I said, maddie, I can't say anything even close to making the pain you're feeling right now get any better. I wish I could, but I can't. But I just and I was talking, I wasn't leaving him as he, I just said I love you dearly and if there's anything at all that either me or the company or all your friends can do. But I said, matt, I just, I'm just devastated. And you know he, he said, look, I've cried all day long. He said I have no more tears left for today anyway, but I really appreciate you reaching out. He said I've, you know I've had heaps of miss messages and calls. We said you know I wanted I'm glad when I saw your name pop up. So that sort of made me feel like it was. It was definitely useful, certainly for me and and hopefully for him.
John McGrath:But the hard one, troy, the only other bit of advice I'd say preceding all these things, which is kind of quite timey for our industry, tommy, just Troy, sorry before you jump into it is I'm trying and I remember hearing Ivan Breschick say this you know it's funny when you look back at Eric and events and you've been to a someone says something and then it stays with you forever and I remember Ivan saying that and he was talking more about deals than life tragedies. But you know, deals fall over and even you know that can throw people off and upset people. It's nothing like the other things we've just discussed. But, and he said you know, what I've learned is never get the high highs or the low lows. Just try. And you know, if a deal happens, that's nice, that's great, let's, let's sort of have a brief celebration and then move on with with it. Don't, you know, stand there and high five yourself and, you know, create a massive because guess what, there's going to be a deal fall over tomorrow, and and then when that happens, also don't go to the opposite end of the scale, don't go down the depths of depression. Just, you know, just try and stay in general in life, kind of in that mid bandwidth and I remember you know Ivan said many, many sharp and smart things over the years and you know I'm fortunate to have him as a dear friend, as you guys do. But that was.
John McGrath:That was very, I thought, a very practical, helpful tool is don't get carried away with your wins and don't get carried away with your losses. Now, that doesn't mean you can't enjoy them absolutely. You know, enjoy a win, enjoy it, enjoy something that goes right and take your spouse out for a little dinner or something, but just do it within the realms of your bandwidth. That, not not this euphoric high that some people tend to get, and not only is now, but they don't just get it, tommy, but nowadays they tend to show it on social media and they're screaming at all the records I've created. I'm just thinking, man, you're setting yourself up for maybe a failure. Troy over to you. What are your thoughts?
Troy Malcolm:yeah, john and some. You know, coping with grief is such a highly individual process and you know what works for one may not work for another. The one thing that I was really, really interested in seeing on the weekend or during the week when Matt did post that amazing video where he was sharing his feelings, was the way the real estate community was commenting and engaging and generally just making sure that Matt was okay. And I think that you know, sometimes we do take for granted and we look at our competition as not our friends and not part of the community. But it was so refreshing to see some of the heartfelt tributes, not only to Logan but just reaching out to Matt and his family to make sure that people knew that he was there.
Troy Malcolm:Because the reality is there's really no timeline and there's no set time for the healing process. And I'm sure Matt probably hasn't read all of those comments, those really beautiful comments that were made on the video, on tiktok and also Facebook and Instagram. But I'm sure at some point in time he will have a quiet moment and he will realize that he is loved and that the family is loved and people generally do care. And that was really refreshing for me because I just feel that in this day and age it's so easy to get caught up with what you mentioned earlier, john the highest of highs and the lowest of lows but knowing that this community of real estate professionals is all there to support each other as one big kind of extended family was something that was really touching for me.
Tom Panos:Yeah, 100%.
John McGrath:You said to me earlier, tom, just when you were discussing, what you wanted to talk about today is build yourself a good team. I was going to say before you need it, but we always need a good team all the time. I'm not talking about a good PA or by hospital. I'm talking about some good, solid people around you you can go to. You guys are dear friends of mine and I can call you If I need anything.
John McGrath:People like Dr Fred has been incredible help. I mean, once upon a time he said to me, john, you know, in the hotels when they say in case of emergency, brake blast and hit the red button, he said I'm your red button. Anything ever goes wrong. First thing I want you to encourage you to do is pick up the phone and call me. That gives you incredible safety and strength and to be able to have a few people like that, I think, in anticipation of us all having a wonderful life but embedded with a myriad of challenges along the way. Try and assemble a really good team of people around you that you can call when the proverbial hits the fan. I don't want to steal that from you, tommy, but just saying that you did share that with me earlier and I agree with you Get yourself a great team.
Tom Panos:Yes, so I think John and Troy, I was given a book in treatment by a chemo nurse called Option B and it was the COO and I think she's still the COO of Facebook Very young person that had tragedy in her life and she talks about in the book. You've actually pretty much summarized it with the stuff that you're saying and one of those things was she says you've got to be very careful and be very mindful of not worrying about saying, not ringing people up, because and I noticed this myself it wasn't John or Troy with you guys, but I noticed when I got unwell a lot of people didn't ring because, not that they don't care, but they don't know what to say. So they feel like saying nothing is safer than saying something dumb. But you don't have to really say much. You just got to sort of let people know that you're in their corner. And I think another thing that I read out of that book which is very, very useful and you expressed it when you called Matt John is not to say to people I know what you're going through, because a lot of the times you can't say that, because you lose credibility and authenticity in that conversation because that personal thing well, you don't really know what I'm going through because you're not going through it. I think the best thing that you can say to them is I don't know what you're going through, but all you need to know is that I'm in your corner all the time and I'm thinking of you, and that I'm a phone call away and if there's something small I can do it. Sometimes it's practical things that you can do For people, but I really would love people to read that book. Option be very useful three piece.
Tom Panos:She talks about in that book three things to watch out. The first one is permanence, which is what Ivan Breschek is relating to, where he's saying if things are good, don't get attached to them because they're not permanent, they're not staying good. And if things are bad, don't get attached to them either because they're not staying bad, staying the middle ground, things are just constantly moving. The second P to to be mindful of is personalization. You can fall into the trap to think you're the only person on the planet that has actually got this situation. I mean, the truth is as bad as it is for Matt. Unfortunately, suicide is a An event that happens far too frequently and there are. There are other Matt Steinways out there. There are other mums and dads out there that go through it. Only this morning I was thinking about they came up on my Facebook thing the poor guy that lost the Three three kids that got run over in the one family two years ago, the, the guy up from the Western suburbs in Sydney. I think his name was Abdul, I'm not quite sure what his name was.
Tom Panos:And then the third P Guys is pervasiveness, and that is that we can fall into the trap that we think everything is really bad. But the truth is, john, I even I remember when I'm good, when I was going through Teemo, you're sending me text messages. You want to go for a walk, you want to catch up there. You can actually do things in one area of your life that will make the other area of your life better, if you know what I mean. It doesn't mean that you've got to lie in bed and Matt's not the sort of guy that would do that. That's a sort of guy that I think we'll look after, we'll take self-care and understand. Don't go into a rut and fall into a hole which can be difficult to come back on. But, john, yeah, I've got a.
John McGrath:Tell me you just on that just, I mean, you're right, there are, if you think about it, and depending how close you are, and particularly If you are fairly close to someone as opposed to more of an associate or colleague, but if you're very close, because I remember when our dear friend Steve at Murrow Pass recently another tragedy, and but we were able to, you know, I thought the whole families of the hospital every night. So we organized for meals to be delivered to their home, freshly made every day, so for the sort of 60 days when Steve was on his last decline and and that just saved them having to get home and not have anything or eat something not good for their system and and their nutrition and not have to clean up afterwards. So that was one, and we used to drop in every couple of days some Fresh chicken broth from the bro, the ladder, the, the, the Bronte, bronte, larder. We still even he loved it because he couldn't eat anything solid of course, and it was nutritious. So just a couple of little things, you know which, which really they don't cost much at all. They're just small things. So, yeah, think about if there is anything of a practical nature you can do go and see them, take them for a walk or whatever. It is really helpful and just you know. So I know we've got to finish in a couple of minutes, tommy, but just let's sort of take this down a few notches.
John McGrath:And because we have been talking about some fairly deep Wounds and tragedies that people have endured, but even as we come back to our day-to-day real estate lives, which is what most of our audience is listening to again, manage your own expectations around things to to avoid or perhaps even just reduce Disappointment. You know people just running around saying I've listed this property and I said where's the paperwork? And they say, well, it's in the mail, or you know it's in the email or it's going to come next week. And I said man don't get too excited until the deal's done and it's inked and the money's in the bank and the the paperwork's arrived. So I think just you know we talk a lot about managing Customer expectations to make sure customers don't get disappointed. I think, equally, you know to avoid disappointment at a day-to-day level in this industry is is just yeah, try and manage your own expectations.
John McGrath:I used to. I was telling some of the other day to our coaching an internal McGraw person. I said, you know, I used to assume I would have to sell every property two or three times To actually get the deal done, because I always assume that the first one or the second one, maybe both, would fall over. So then if one went through, I thought our bonus, that's good. If one fell over, I thought, well, I expected that, so let's go and find another buy. So I think you can also sort of going back to Ivan's point you can sort of monitor your own expectations about events and, just, you know, sort of dial them down a little bit so you don't disappoint yourself. Troy, any parting words from you.
Troy Malcolm:No, I think it's such an important topic. Tom, I agree with you that there needs to be more done around resources, around people being more vulnerable and talking about when things aren't going well. I mean, are you okay? Today is a great start, but there's so many other things out there that we can be doing. And just to let everyone know, tom, that book Option B it's by Cheryl Sandberg and it's done with. Adam Grant was the co-author of that and actually, surprisingly, he's actually in Australia very soon speaking. So it's kind of interesting. He's a genius.
Tom Panos:He's a genius. They go Troy. I think you follow him too, John.
Troy Malcolm:I do. Yeah, I do as well. Yeah, he's part of the University of Pennsylvania. I think he's a professor there. So yeah, really, really interesting.
Tom Panos:Okay, well, listen, we're going to finish off on that point. Thank you, troy, for bringing that reference up. Matt Steinway, we salute you. I will never forget John. In 2016, when I caught the relapse and I said I was going to have to do a stem cell transplant, you and Matt came down and all sit down. I don't know if you remember, we were at North Sydney me and Luna Park, john and we're going to shoot a video and I sort of said there's a chance I'm going to be out of action for a year. And my doctor said to me look, you're probably not going to want to be seen on videos and all that because you're not going to look great after the stem cell transplant. And I'll never forget it. Matt said John, and I will take over running the real estate gym until you get better. That's all right. I said Matt, you're in Terrigal mate.
John McGrath:Do you remember that, John? Yeah, we were down by the border there near the. Park.
Tom Panos:That's it.
John McGrath:I said, matt, you're in Terrigal and he mentioned it.
Tom Panos:Yeah, we both mentioned it, but he mentioned it.
John McGrath:He just said whatever it takes, that's the kind of guy he is. So I know he's having his love and generosity reciprocated with all the support that's flocked around him this week. So thank you to everyone that's listening here. That's reached out to Matt. Some would know him well, some not so well, but I know that he's told me that he's been absolutely inundated with love and well wishes and condolences from our industry, not just from our company, but from the greater industry. So thank you to everyone on behalf of Matt, because I know he would love, ideally, to get back to everyone, but in situations like this that's never going to be possible. But yeah, let's dedicate this again to Logan and to Matt. Yeah, rest his soul in peace and let's leave a legacy by doing the rest of our life and being as good a version of ourselves as we can for Logan.
Tom Panos:Well said, John. Thank you, Troy. We'll see you all next week. We've got four or five weeks to go. We'll see you then.